Episode 12: Space2Inspire with Dr. Sian Proctor

Written By Emily Olsen

Show Notes

Dr. Sian Proctor

Transcript

[intro music: “Space” by Music_Unlimited]

Emily

Hello and welcome to the Art Astra Podcast. I’m Emily Olsen.

Alexa

And I’m Alexa Erdogan. 

Emily

Today we have a wonderful guest with us. Dr. Sian “Leo” Proctor is a visionary poet, artist, explorer, and geoscience educator. In 2021, Dr. Proctor made history as the first artist selected to go to space on the SpaceX Inspiration 4 mission. She's the first woman commercial spaceship pilot and the only African-American woman to be a mission pilot. Her motto is “Space 2 Inspire,” and her mission is to bridge the gap between art and science, encouraging everyone to let their Earth light shine. She is an international speaker and the 2024-25 U.S. Department of State Science Envoy for Space. Her SpaceX Inspiration 4 spacesuit is currently on display at the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum in Washington, D.C. 

Sian, welcome to the show!

Alexa

Welcome! Thank you so much for being here.

Sian

Thank you for having me. I'll talk about art in space anytime.

Emily

We're so especially happy to have you because when we were first thinking up this podcast, you were definitely one of the first people we wanted to talk to.

Sian

Wow, I'm so honored. I feel like a lot of my story is, you know, preparation, definitely getting flight ready, but luck, you know, to be the first artist selected to go to space. I, you know, that's just, pure luck there.

Emily

Yeah. We would love to hear about your experience as a member of the Inspiration 4 crew and also how your art shaped your trajectory as an astronaut.

Sian

Sure. I think, you know, it really starts from COVID. So I should preface with saying that I've been chasing space my entire life, but I'm a geoscience professor by training. I've taught geology at the community college for over 25 years, along with sustainability classes. And during COVID, I kind of started doing art and poetry as a way of coping with the fact that

we were in this crazy situation and the chaotic world out there, your own creativity is what you can control. And I had learned that as living as an analog astronaut in Moon and Mars simulation. So I knew that when I'm in isolated, confined, extreme environments, that it's my creativity that I like to lean into. And so during COVID, I started doing space art and poetry, combining the two together and sending out postcards to people as a way of spreading cheer around the world. And I had no idea that literally nine months later, it would win me a seat to space. In February of 2021, they announced the first all-civilian mission to orbit and that you could win one of two seats. The generosity seat was if you donated to St. Jude Children's Research Hospital.  And then the Prosperity seat was a little bit more work. It was only on Twitter. Twitter is now X, but Twitter. And you had to, not only did you have to open up a shop and provide some kind of service, but you also had to create a two-minute video expressing why they should pick you for that seat.

So I had been doing my art and people kept asking, “Is it for sale? Can I get a piece?” And I didn't have anything. So I thought, this is the perfect opportunity for me to become an art entrepreneur. But then for the contest, I decided to write an original poem called “Space2Inspire.”

And so I read that as my entry for my two-minute Twitter video. And luckily it resonated with a lot of people and I got selected for the Inspiration for Prosperity seat.

Alexa

That's amazing. What a wild ride from being able to combine and tap into your creativity and that leading you to go closer to the stars. It's such a beautiful thing to happen, and poetic in itself, I feel like.

Sian

Yeah, definitely, because, again, I had been chasing space. I had been a finalist for the 2009 NASA astronaut selection process, you know, really the more traditional route as a scientist and an educator. And I got down to that “yes/no” phone call.

And Suni Williams, one of the two astronauts who were quote, “stuck” on the ISS, (not really stuck, but, you know, was up there for an extended period). I remember she called me and said, you know, “Sorry, we didn't pick you. Please apply again in the future.” You know, and I'm here… I am 39 years old at the time thinking, yeah, that that was potentially my last shot at becoming a NASA astronaut, but not ever giving up hope. I kind of, you know, I rebranded as an analog astronaut. I and that's how I thought I would be contributing to the advancement of human space, spaceflight. And then as commercial space started to develop, I thought, oh, well, maybe one day I'll make it to space that way, not knowing, boy, that it was going to happen so quickly and in such a unique way.

Alexa

Yeah! It's an amazing story to hear every single time. And one thing I'm actually really curious about is, you know, you actually put together a piece of art. You actually did art in space while you were up there. And I'm so curious what that sensation was like and if it was any different from how you do art on Earth. Like what was it like to actually paint? Did, like what kind of paints did you use? Did the sensation of like brush to canvas feel any different? Any of those like intricacies?

Sian

Yeah. So when SpaceX asked me if there was anything I wanted to do in space, I said, “Yes, paint.”  And you can imagine their reaction at first was like, yeah, that's not happening.

But then I referenced Nicole Stott, NASA astronaut who had painted a watercolor in space.

And once they had heard that had been done before, they were like, “Okay, let's figure this out.”

And it was really amazing because, you know, I wanted to do a watercolor. I didn't have a lot of experience as a painter. I'm more of a collage artist. That was my roots coming through COVID. But I assembled this kind of like beautiful watercolor kit with the help of SpaceX. And I was super nervous, you know, we're up there for three days and they wanted me to paint.

I not only did I paint, I also drew in space. I drew this beautiful dragon holding the dragon capsule. And they were kind of like, “When are you going to start painting?” And I was like, “Ah, okay.”

And so I kind of…You know,  to draw and paint takes time. And I'm so grateful to not only SpaceX, but my crew members for giving me that space, So I kind of hunkered down into a corner of the Dragon capsule because you're floating. I velcroed all of my stuff in place to where I needed it. And then you got to like brace yourself because the big thing is the modern watercolor brushes make it easy to paint in space because you don't have to manage water. So what we did was we pre-filled about 6 paintbrushes with water before the launch.

And so if you know that you can buy brushes that you can put water in for watercolor now.

So now what's happening is you don't have to manage your water because surface tension is going to do it for you. You can squeeze the water in the brush handle and it will come out to the bristles and it will stick there because of surface tension.

And then you can swirl it into your paint. And again, your paint's going to stay onto the brush because of surface tension and then apply it to the canvas. So that was all pretty much just like you would do here on earth, except you're floating. 

And then as you're moving, you're bobbing and weaving as you're painting – Newton's law of equal and opposite force. So any little thing that you do onto the canvas is going to push you back. And so it's this kind of fun thing where you're trying to like manage your energy and push against things to hold yourself in place as you're as you're painting.

But I was pretty much terrified that I was going to mess it up. You get one shot to paint in space. [laughs] And I got one shot. And so I'm pretty happy that it turned out as well as it did along with the drawing that I did.

Emily

That's truly so cool. I didn't even think about the force of while you're just like painting in a zero-gravity environment. 

Sian

Yeah, and so you don't need a lot of energy. And that's managing your energy as a result of that, but you definitely need to hold on to things. I remember I took one of the caps off of the paintbrush and I forgot and I let it go. And it - within two seconds, it's like floating off and you're like, “Oh, where did that go?” And you worry about those kinds of things because you've got like the forward hatch, you know, you don't want to get it when you're opening it and closing it to get into the cupola. You don't want that piece to get stuck there because it could break in the seal or it could damage and luckily it floated over to Haley. And Haley grabbed and it's like, “Did you lose this?”

And I'm like, “Yes, give that back to me.” [laughs]

So everything was accounted for. We did lose a couple of M&Ms probably and Skittles, you know, in the capsule. But for the most part, we did a good job of not letting things go rogue.

Emily

I didn't even think about things like essentially wandering off on their own. That's just an additional challenge.

Sian

Yeah, yeah. Everything was velcroed in. And that's what's great about SpaceX. I actually have my watercolor kit that SpaceX helped design. I know you can't see it on the podcast, but I can show you. And we can post the video to me painting in space where I show this. And it was really great design where you open it up. And this is actually paper leftovers. So this paper has been to space.

So when I open it, there's a compartment for me to have my paper. And then when you open it up to the bigger folded area here, it's where the watercolors are. And it's pretty much the same from when I went to space, which I haven't really changed much. The only thing is that the watercolor pens are in a plastic bag now, but it's all velcroed in. And the water that's still in here was the water that went to space. So I want to use it to create some kind of cool artwork down here on Earth when I'm ready. But this is all space-flown watercolors. And so what I can do is hopefully use them and make some beautiful art down here and say it was made with paint that flew to space. And paint for that flew to space.

Alexa & Emily 

So cool. [laughs]

Sian

And you go and you're traveling at 17,500 miles per hour. So you're going into a sunrise or a sunset every 45 minutes. People are like, “What were you looking at?”  Well, you're not looking out the window because the window's changing. You really have to go with something in your head that you can that you want to paint and so that's why, you know, I didn't do it up in the cupola or I wasn't looking out the window because there's no point to do that.

Emily

That makes sense. So being an artist in space is such a great example of how interdisciplinary space can be. What do you see as the significance of bringing people with backgrounds in humanities, like art and poetry, into space?

Sian

Well, it provides a new way of looking at things. There are a lot of astronauts who are artists: Alan Bean, a beautiful artist; Nicole Stott; musicians, Chris Hadfield…And you think about the fact that these individuals are so well-rounded because they've got that technical science and engineering background, but yet they have this artistic side. But I came in leaning more on that artistic side. And as a result, I feel like it helped me see the earth and have this experience in a way that I could come back and share it through my poetry.

I wrote a poem called “Earthlight” because of my experience of seeing the earth. And many astronauts have talked about the glow of the earth, but I'm the first one to be like, “Oh my God, what is this? It's Earthlight. It's so bright. You know what?”

And I think it was the combination of me as an artist and as a scientist, especially a geoscientist who has studied their earth their entire life. And it immediately clicked that when I was up there in the cupola that I was being bathed in earthlight. And then, okay, now I know scientifically what that is, but now how do I express that poetically to people when I come back home?

And that's one of the fun parts of being an artist is that you get to take these interesting experiences. And if you have a scientific background, I think that that just adds to that.

And then you get to share it with the world in a way that is different.

Emily

That's truly so cool. Before following your journey on the mission, I had never heard of Earthlight before, but we think of moonlight or sunlight all the time.

Sian

Yeah!

Emily

To your point, it's definitely a new perspective and it's just such a cool way of thinking not only about Earth, but literally just like Earth in space. and witnessing Earth from a spacecraft.

Sian

Yeah, but I'll take it one step further. What I realized is that, you know, we live in Earthlight.

You know, we know about sunlight and we know about moonlight, but as we go outside, we talk about how we're, you know, we're walking out into sunlight, but that's actually not true.

We're walking out into Earthlight. And it's because of our planet's ability to really transform sunlight into color right because you don't see color until it interacts with materials and gets scattered and reflected.

Well, that's all properties of our beautiful planet Earth and so, you know, when we think about this phenomenon of earthlight, the analogy I like to use is a fish in water. Does a fish know it's in water until it jumps out and sees, you know, they're like, “Oh, wait, what is this?”  And then they go back in. And to me, that was going to space. I had to go to space and be like, “Whoa, wait, what is this that I just left behind? That's so bright and beautiful.” 

And I'm like, “Oh my goodness, that's Earthlight. Oh, okay. What does that really mean?” and coming back.  And so what's interesting is I never thought I would write a science book, but then I came back. I had to like, get this phenomenon out of me and be like, “Okay, people need to know about Earthlight. How do I do that?” So I wrote this science book that has poetry in it, has art in it, but it's fundamentally a science book on Earthlight.

Alexa

That must have been such a...sort of like, I don't know if out-of-body experience is the best way to describe it, but we hear often times about the Overview Effect and how seeing the Earth radically changes people's perceptions of Earth and then how they go about their day-to-day life when they get back to Earth. Would you say there's some kind of a connection there between experiencing earthlight with your whole body and the sort of spiritual and perspective shifts with the Overview Effect in general?

Sian

Oh yeah, Frank White's Overview Effect is amazing, and so - I'm a good friend with Frank, and I knew about it before I went to space, and so I was kind of like...thinking about it from a scientist’s perspective, I'm like, why is it that astronauts floating in space, seeing the earth get this overwhelming sense of connectedness to our planet and the whole no borders and all of that?

Whereas you can show a person that same photo of the earth here and they don't feel anything, not the same way. And so, as my science brain, I was like, okay, one, they're floating and can we replicate that on earth and get that? Is it the floating or is it the perspective of being in space? Like what is it that's causing that cognitive shift?

And then when I realized I was being bathed in Earthlight, the light bulb went off and I'm like, “Oh my God." I believe that Earthlight is the fuel for the Overview Effect because it's the energy. You are getting just bombarded by Earthlight, which is not just the reflection of sunlight and transformation of sunlight that's coming back to you. It's also all of the biology, the biodiversity of life that's combined into that earthlight, including humans. We pump a lot of energy out into, you know, off planet, basically. And so you sit there and you literally get bombarded with energy. And the best way I can make the analogy is when you walk outside and it's a full moon rising, think about how that makes you feel when you're walking in moonlight and you see the moon up there. You know, most people feel this kind of like connection to the moon and moonlight. Now imagine being in Low Earth Orbit and you're - it's a thousand times brighter and you're like, “Whoa, what is this amazing thing?” And you're just being bombarded by that energy. And so I definitely think there's a connection between Earthlight and the Overview Effect. I think they're fundamentally connected in the sense that Earthlight provides the actual energy that is hitting you during that Overview experience.

Alexa

Sounds very much like a real full body sensation that…

Sian

It is!

Alexa

… you can't really replicate, 'cause I was thinking about, like, I'm sure somebody would develop some kind of like virtual reality or something like that, but it just feels like one of those things where you have to be there to experience it.

Sian

Yeah, It truly is stunningly beautiful. I equate it to a portrait in motion. Like the Earth, it's always changing. And humanity has a big part in that change. But as you just sit there and you're floating, you're literally watching it transform and change right in front of you. And yet it's so stunningly beautiful.

Emily

And it's especially just so interesting to hear about it, like from your perspective, from being an artist and having your artistic practice and bringing that to space.

You've mentioned your book – we will make sure that is linked in the show notes. And we'll also be linking in the show notes the Netflix documentary series, Countdown Inspiration 4: Mission to Space, which is a very detailed account of your mission. And in that documentary and on your website, you mentioned being born on Guam and your dad's history with NASA. Can you tell us more about that?

Sian

Yes, I was really fortunate that my dad was working at the NASA tracking station during the Apollo missions. So our family was on Guam for four years from 1966 to 1970. So my dad started working as a contractor for NASA back in… basically Gemini through Apollo. And then the Apollo missions, he was on Guam and we were there for Apollo 11. And so I'm a moon celebration baby.

When Neil Armstrong took those first steps on the moon that was in July of 1969. And I was born in March of 1970, which is 8 1/2 months, 8 1/2 months later. And I'm like, yeah, and I'm the youngest of four. So I'm like, that was definitely a moon celebration, baby.

[laughter]

Sian

So I kind of just feel like space has always been a part of me. Soon after I was born, we left Guam. But I grew up with all of this beautiful NASA memorabilia to my dad, including Neil Armstrong's autograph. A lot of people don't realize this, but when the Apollo 11 astronauts came back from the moon, they did a tour of all the tracking stations around the world. And so they came to Guam and my dad got to meet Neil Armstrong. And he wrote a beautiful note that said, “to Ed,” who's my dad, Ed. “To Ed, thanks for all the help, Neil Armstrong, Apollo 11.” And my dad passed away when I was 19. So he never got to see me, you know, become the person I am today. But I got to fly the Neil Armstrong autograph in space and just such a beautiful moment for me.

Alexa

I remember earlier in this conversation you were talking about how space has always been in you and you started going towards the traditional path to space by applying for a NASA astronaut and then shifting gears to analog astronaut before eventually making your way back up towards the stars again. And I'm kind of curious, you know, the parallel between your expectations of what it would be like in space from your experience as an analog astronaut and how that shifted after you went to space is sort of like the contrast there in your perspective.

Sian

Yeah, and for those who are listening and don't know what an analog astronaut is, it's somebody who lives voluntarily in a moon or Mars simulation here on Earth. And so there's a bunch of habitats around the world. Some of them are funded by NASA. Some of them are run by NASA.

And so I was fortunate in 2013 to live in the high seas habitat on the big island of Hawaii for four months, funded by NASA to investigate food strategies for long duration spaceflight.

But I've also done a few other analogs. And this is all about going to the moon and Mars and how do you do that successfully and create crew cohesion and all of those things.

But what I learned during those simulations was a lot about myself and the things that I need when I'm living in an isolated and confined and extreme environment and a big core of that is creativity. And that's one of the things when I realized that every time I lived in these simulated environments that I had to paint or draw or write poetry or do something, that's when I was like, because I would leave and then I wouldn't do it again. It was only in these simulated spaces,  when I felt confined and not in control to some extent, that I would lean into my creativity. 

And so I think that it really kind of prepared me in a sense of… I knew how to get along with other people from around the world in very tight spaces. I know I'm a morning person, like I know that I'm more of an introvert than an extrovert.

Like just some of these things that you learn about yourself and what you need so that when you come and you become a part of a group that's doing something so intense like going to space, you can share your strengths and your needs so that you and your crewmates can get along and build that cohesion.

But the experiences are so different from each other because there's nothing better than floating in space. I think the next best thing would be floating in space for a while until you land on the moon or on Mars. And then you become a Moon or Mars walker. And then, you know, that would be pretty cool.

Emily

Yes, absolutely. While you were describing the analog missions and if it's for the Moon or Mars, do those missions have fundamental differences beyond their objectives?

Sian

You know, the thing about it is those are really driven by the research that's coming in. So typically, for example, the HI-SEAS mission, four months, four months living in a dome. And every time you went outside, you had to dress in a space suit. And it was on the Big Island of Hawaii at 8,000 feet above sea level on the slopes of Mauna Loa. So very volcanic, no trees, none of that stuff. And we were there to investigate food strategies for long duration space flight for NASA.

And so every day we were either eating like astronauts eat right now, which is just add water and heat meals versus being able to creatively cook with freeze dried fruits, meats, vegetables, you know, and NASA wanted to know what is your bang for your buck for those: giving that creativity of cooking versus already pre-packaged pre-prepared meals. 

We did that for four months and that was the core of what we were doing but then we did things like we drove the Canadian Space Agency Rover remotely. We had robotic pets in the habitat to see if that helped with the isolation and loneliness. We had t-shirts that we wore to combat microbial growth because you don't have a lot of clothes in space. And so these were kind of the things that you do daily, but you’re also living your life. There's birthdays and celebrations and you're going out on geology excursions. And so it's pretty cool. 

Whereas, in space, you're right now, you go up and you're in a spaceship. And for us, we're in a Dragon capsule, which is pretty tight quarters for four people to live in for three days. It's not like we go into the ISS where you have a little bit more space, right? And so you are living and negotiating very tight quarters. And to make it, so people understand it: think about camping in a tent with four other people and the tent is not that big and you can never leave the tent. 

[laughter]

So you're cozy for three days. Your bathroom's in there, your window’s there, like your food, everything. And there's no getting away. Whereas as an analog astronaut, you have rooms and compartments and places that you can kind of like go and you can have some alone time to some extent.

Emily

That's a great way to think about it. Coming from the analog astronaut experience, were there any aspects of your actual trip to space that you found especially surprising?

Sian

Well, Earthlight was the biggest surprise because I'm like, I'm a geologist. I'm like, “how did I not know this term?”  [laughter] I'm like, “Whoa,” you know. And it's funny because I teach about the Earth and I know that the Earth has a high reflectivity. And it wasn't until I was up there that I was like, “Whoa, what is this?”

I'm trying to think of surprises. Besides, like, again, the sheer beauty of our planet, you just can't… Even as an artist, you can't express what it's like when you see you're moving into a sunrise or a sunset and the color change and the clouds and how it is just so moving and so beautiful. 

You can get an appreciation for it to some extent when you think about the most beautiful sunset you've ever seen. And then imagine having that in space, being able to see lightning. Okay, lightning from space is freaking cool because you see the tops of the cloud, and we were higher than the International Space Station. We were 585 kilometers up. So we got to see a large area of the Earth. And it was great because you'd see these big squall lines of big thunderstorms rolling in across like the United States. And it would just be lightning at the tops of these clouds going bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam. And you're like, “Whoa, this is crazy.”  It's so cool. And this is at night. So you see off in the distance the city lights and where it's completely clear, but then you see this big giant storm that's headed that way based on the lightning that's firing off at the tops of the clouds.

Alexa

That's so cool. I feel like we've said that phrase so many times throughout this, but it really, truly is so cool. You said that originally your origins were in geoscience and, you know, you continue to be a scientist in that field. I'm curious if your experience in space and having your experiences with Earthlight and seeing our planet in a different way, if that has impacted your scientific practice at all and how you view geoscience and sustainability after coming back from space.

Sian

Oh, yeah. Well, I've always thought that they were essential, but absolutely, I think that everybody should have a fundamental idea of how Earth processes work and the role humanity plays in not only our changing climate, but also the way we terraform Earth.

We are builders, and you can see it. You can see it from space. You can see the city lights, and you can see the cities, and you can see where we've built and where we haven't built. It's pretty incredible to think about humans as a species and what we are capable of doing.

But I think that being alive and being a part of this amazing Earth system is also important and finding harmony and balance between Earth and Earthlight. If it wasn't for Earthlight, life wouldn't exist. I would love to see us more in tune to the world around us and this whole kind of perception, the way we see our planet and our connection to it.

Emily

Absolutely. So this experience shaped your perspective of your scientific practice moving forward. Did it also change your artistic practice?

Sian

Yeah, to some extent, you know, I think it's more like my mission is to bring earthlight down to earth. And I do it in multiple ways through my artistic practice. So I do it as a space poet and really sharing this concept of letting your earthlight shine and the fact that we are all part of this beautiful planet. But then also as an artist, I think that, for me, ways of getting people to understand the connection. So I do a series called “One Sky, One Ocean.” Again, that connectedness to our planet from an environmental standpoint, thinking about the fact that we are connected by one sky and one ocean, we have a responsibility to take care of those places.

And so I think a lot of it shows up with those kinds of expressions in my art. I love combining art and poetry and really writing words about what I'm thinking into my art as part of my practice. And I hope to continue to grow and figure out ways of expressing myself.

I'm still developing as an artist. I've only been doing art five years and I haven't even been doing it full-time. I'm just about to retire from being a full-time community college professor and shift into being a full-time artist and poet. So I'm learning a lot still and developing my voice.

But I found my authentic voice as an artist and a poet. And so I feel so fortunate that I get to spend this later half of my life doing this.

Alexa

That can be such a difficult thing. I feel like sometimes when you're trying to tap into your sort of pool of creativity to really find your voice and your authenticity as who you are. Because like, for example, if you are formally educated in art, you'll learn about so many different ways other people do things. And then it takes you so long to actually figure out, wait, this is what works for me. And this is what is the best representation of how I see the world and how I want to share the world with other people.

Sian

And a lot of people have been very surprised at how quickly I've kind of like developed as an artist. Me too, I look at where I am now and I look at my early work and I'm like, “Oh my God, don't even look at my early work. This is my stuff that I'm doing now so much better.” But being able to realize the things that you love, like I realize I'm a collage artist. I'm a geometric line artist. I like to look at things, people, and dance. A lot of my figures that are my core figures are dance poses. I look at the human body and I think, “Wow, wouldn't it be great if we could dance our way through space?” And so most of what I call my collage characters are dancing, but they're all in geometric-like shapes and they all have helmets on because I want people to be able to see themselves in my art, instead of saying that a race or ethnicity or something like that. But I do try to make it so that you can see females. 

Because particularly in my early art, when I was looking at things to, like, get inspiration from, right? Because as an early artist, a lot of times you're looking at other things and you're trying to draw them, but in your own unique style, I couldn't find female astronauts because they tend to be that typical kind of like male-looking astronaut.

And I thought, well, let's reinvent the space suit and take this and make it where instead of it's a big bulky thing and you can't tell whether it's a male or a female, let's be able to let people know that, yeah, you know, it's a female and she's dancing her way through space doing some amazing things. That to me is important to have that representation. Particularly since I'm the first woman commercial spaceship pilot. [laughter]

Alexa

Yeah, for sure.

Emily

I'm struck by the image of people dancing through space because dance requires such an economy and grace of movement. And for when you're piloting a spacecraft and there's just such a finite resource of fuel and you have to be so intentional. That's just truly so cool to me. 

Also, what just pinged around in my brain is the children's book, Mae Among the Stars. It's a really beautiful children's book about Mae Jemison. And it talks about how when she originally, before she became an astronaut, she wanted to be a dancer.

Sian

Yes, she wanted to be a dancer. Mhm!

Emily

And her mom told her to maybe pursue dance after college. 

Sian

Yeah!

Emily

And that's how she went on the astronaut path instead. So it's truly, it's just so cool.

Sian

It really is. And I just feel like that, again, the arts and how we express ourselves out in space is going to be so important. And that's why I love that so many astronauts are artists. They’re musicians. They are creatives. And now they're expressing that more. In the past, they didn't. It was like one of those things like Alan Bean didn't start painting until he came back from space.

And I think that now that you have so many commercial people going. You're seeing more artists go. We've got filmmakers going. Fram-2 had an amazing film crew on it.

And you know, the Polaris Dawn, you had Sarah Gillis doing this amazing – she played the violin in space! So technically difficult to do! And then she had this beautiful space hair and she coordinated it with all of these orchestras of kids from around the world and just beautiful the way we are starting to cultivate that cultural humanities side and bring it to space with us.

Alexa

No, definitely. I think that's a great way to put that. And I know I'm not alone in being so eager to see how your artistic vision progresses over the years, as I'm sure the experience of space sort of percolates in you and comes out in your creativity and your expression of that. 

I'm curious, you know, in the last five years or so that you said that you've been actually focusing a lot more on art, what has been your most famous art piece, either publicly or even like a piece that really resonates with you most strongly, even if it may not be as popular or well known by other people?

Sian

Well, my most famous art piece was done literally the month before I won Inspiration 4. I didn't even know Inspiration 4 was going to be a thing. It was January of 2021. Again, Twitter. Twitter has been good to me.  And somebody on there said, “Hey, you know, Richard Garriott's going down to the bottom of the Mariana Trench and with Challenger Deep, you and he's taking poetry and art with him.  You should connect.” 

And they, you know, put Richard Garriott, who's the president of the Explorers Club in there and me. And I kind of like I saw it and I kind of chuckled because I'm like, “There's no way, you know? He doesn't know who I am.” But he replied to the thread and he's like, “Yeah, I'm leaving in four days. If you can get me an art piece, I will take it with me or a poem.”

And he's like, “I'm only taking cinquains.” And I was like, “cinquains…?” I'm like, “What the heck is that?” And I had to look it up. And then I was like, “I gotta draw an art piece” and I was born on Guam, which sits on the Mariana Trench. So I'm like, “Oh, this is an opportunity for me to bring my art down to the bottom of the ocean.” 

So I went and I drew this beautiful line art piece and it had my character Afro Gaia which is my representation of Mother Earth and the trench and all of this stuff and all of these colors.

And I made copies of it and I sent him not only that but I also sent him like postcards and stuff because I was like one day I'm gonna send this art to space, you know. And it was really funny because Blue Origin had already started talking about postcards and stuff to space. And so I packaged it all up and I send it to him and then in the next basically two months, I win Inspiration 4 and by the time Richard Garriott went down and came back up I had already won and he gets back to me. 

He's like, “You're going to space!”  Now what's cool is Richard Garriott went to space. He's a second generation astronaut. His dad, Owen Garriott, was a NASA astronaut. And then Richard Garriott was a commercial astronaut. He paid his way to go to the International Space Station back in 2008. And he also did art while he was up there and a really cool abstract art project. So he's a really cool, interesting guy.

So he's like, “You're going to be able to bring your art to space!” And I'm like, “I know!” 

But then the interesting thing is, so now this art piece has gone down to the Mariana Trench with an astronaut, and it's stamped and signed on the back by him.

And then it comes back to me, and it just so happens that a good friend of mine is married to Scott Perezinski, who is a five-time NASA astronaut, retired. And they, as a couple, were going down to the Titanic in that ill-fated sub. Luckily, they were fine on it, but they went down on at the Titan sub, and they brought my art and poem with them. And I wrote a poem on the back called “Seeker.” And they come back up and they sign it. And so now this art piece has been down to the deepest part of our planet. It's been down to the most iconic shipwreck. And then it went to space with me and my Inspiration 4 crew. And we all signed the back. So now this art piece was signed by 6 astronauts and it's been all like, it's so uniquely traveled. I call it adventure art.

And then we were doing the largest fundraiser in St. Jude Children's Research Hospital's history. So I donated that piece to St. Jude, and it sold at auction. You know, as a new artist, I'm sitting there holding it and we're doing this big art auction thing and it sold for $100,000. Now the interesting thing is this: the person who bought it was my commander, Jared Isaacman, because he loved the piece. And it goes full circle.

And it was a kind of a cool bidding war between him and another guy to get this piece. Jared got the idea to go to space when he flew to Russia in 2008 to watch a commercial launch.

And that commercial launch was Richard Garriott's. Crazy! 

Alexa

That is wild! 

Sian

I can't make this stuff up. I cannot make this up. Like what a full circle moment! And so somewhere in Jared's desk or in his memorabilia is this art line art piece. And on the back is a poem called “Seeker,” which was cinquain that I wrote for that.

Emily

That's absolutely incredible. As you were, as you were telling us, like everywhere, it's so cool to think about the things you've seen as an artist, as an astronaut, but also just like what your art has seen and experienced is so cool.

Sian

Yeah, I do adventure art. So I've been to Antarctica three times. So I bring art down there with me. And so I'm holding my art and it's like this has been on an adventure. And so an example would be like this piece right here. This is… I'm holding up a piece that I call her “Grateful Voyager.”  A lot of my art in the last couple of years uses laser technology.

I became a digital geometric line artist. And one of the things people struggle with is like, if you're a digital artist, how do you make that into unique one-of-one pieces? And so this is canvas that I spray painted and then laser etched my design into it, my geometric line art design. Another example is I have a piece here that went to Antarctica that is, again, it's been laser etched onto rolled canvas that I spray painted. And so these are the kinds of things that I'll take on my adventure art with me but it's cool because as a collage artist, I usually do space art, but I started doing animals.

On this piece, I have an orca, I have an albatross that's wearing a space helmet, and I have an emperor penguin. And I have a whale to represent going to Antarctica.

Alexa

I love that the albatross is wearing a space helmet.

Sian

I know. [laughs] It's a wandering albatross. How can you not put it in a space helmet?

Alexa

Oh, I love it. You know, as you talk about your art and your experiences, it seems like a lot of the values that you hold are really about like interconnectivity. 

Sian

Oh yeah.

Alexa

….And I guess that sort of ties really into your background in sustainability as well and sort of seeing everything as connected together. And that also ties into your whole concept of Space2Inspire and what you've referred to before as like the JEDI approach to space. So could you tell us a little bit more about Space2Inspire and that JEDI approach?

Sian

Yeah, you know, my motto is Space2Inspire. And people a lot of times think that was a result of Inspiration 4, which was the name of my mission. But I actually had my motto, Space 2 Inspire, before that. And that's why I wrote my poem. Well, that won me my seat to space is called “Space2Inspire.”

And in that poem, I talk about the need to create a JEDI space: a just, equitable, diverse, and inclusive space for all of humanity. I grew up with Star Wars and Star Trek. It's a Star Wars acronym, but it's a Star Trek meaning. I am a Trekkie through and through. And this whole idea of us boldly going together is super important to me.

I wanted to express that in the poem that I submitted. You know even to this day, I'm like, I'm channeling ancestors or something because that poem just came right out of me that I wrote and recorded that video. I think that the connection of space to inspire. And again, space to inspire is not about outer space. It's about your space, the space that makes you, and how you can use your unique, beautiful space to inspire yourself and those around you and hopefully beyond.

And, as we're doing that, how do we make our own space a just, equitable, diverse, and inclusive space? And so, I think that it's important to have…be grounded in messages of  and values that you hold on to, even when you're in a time when DEI is being attacked and all of those kinds of things. I'm sorry. Look, I don't know who doesn't want to have a just, equitable, diverse, and inclusive space for all of humanity. And if you don't, I don't want to live in that space. I want a Star Trek future.  I don't want Star Wars future. I want a Star Trek future. I want us to boldly go together. But there are people who are like, “I want a Star Wars future.” And I'm like, “Yeah, well, have fun with that. I'm going to be over here with my Star Trek friends.”

Alexa

No, for sure. The Star Trek universe has always been such like, it feels like a safe place to just be in because I also grew up on Star Trek a lot. And I'm actually kind of curious: do you have a Star Trek, specific Star Trek that is your favorite?

Sian

Oh, of course. The Next Generation, baby!

Alexa

Nice. [laughter]

Sian

That came out when I was in high school and I watched it with my dad just before he passed away because he was a huge Trekkie and he's the one who got me and my siblings to be Trekkies. And so, no, I mean, I'm a… Wil Wheaton. One of these days, I'm gonna meet Wil Wheaton. So if you're listening to this podcast, Wil, you want to meet an astronaut, let me know.

And just know Jean-Luc Picard and Data and all of that is just love, love, love it. But the entire series, so so advanced, so futuristic, so inclusive and thoughtful in Gene Roddenberry's vision of a future that we could actually look at and say, “Yeah, we can aspire to that future.”

And yes, Star Wars has some cool stuff, but it's all about…it's a constant battle against good and evil where, I love the idea of at least in Star Trek, us humans got our act together here on Earth. And we learned to get along and we created the Federation and we decided to go and do this together. What a beautiful thought.

Emily

Absolutely. I was raised on both Star Wars and Star Trek, but I would definitely prefer a Star Trek universe, especially, I mean, when you've got like the massive famous design flaws and things like the Death Star. [laughter] 

But also somebody, I remember seeing on Twitter or X recently that somebody's pointing out that there is more of a Star Trek aesthetic in the SpaceX suit design where you've got much cleaner lines and less clunkier equipment today, especially like in the commercial craft, which is really interesting because I hadn't even clocked that, but just in terms of the screens versus the shuttle button panels and things like that.

Sian

Oh yeah, no, a lot of the…I think the space industry is Trekkies. They like both Star Wars and Star Trek, but a lot of that innovation to aspire to is definitely Star Trek. And you definitely can see it. So if you're listening, go to Washington, D.C. and see my space suit. I call her Leo as my call sign. She's in the New “Futures in Space” exhibit at the Air and Space Museum but beautifully designed, the capsule, the Dragon, that's all a work of art, too. People don't, you know, a lot of times people don't see the art in science and the science and art, but it's there and needs to be appreciated. And whenever I think about the Dragon capsule, the interior, the spacesuit, I'm thinking, wow, these are beautiful works of art.

Alexa

No, I love that, the concept of design and how we have to rethink design in order to extend ourselves closer towards the stars and into space is a beautiful thought to have.

We both would love to talk to you about space and art all night long, [laughter]  but we want to be mindful of your time as well. And also get your thoughts, for example, on your experiences in the industry and anybody else that might want to find a path towards the stars, you know, maybe in a similar way that you did or maybe in their own unique fashion, too. So as we sort of wind down towards the end of the episode we wanted to ask you, do you have any specific advice for people who are interested in space, whether that's being an astronaut or just working in the industry or just being a part of the space and the space art community collectively in general? 

Sian

Yeah, I would say it's a lot of it's about authenticity, but also, what problem do you want to solve?

And I think that that's if you can go in problem driven and a desire to solve that problem, you will have to lean into the science and the technology and innovation and the art and all of that to solve that problem. 

And I think that can take you in ways you would never imagine. For me, my current problem that I'm trying to solve is how do I bring earthlight down to earth so that people feel as connected to earthlight as they do to moonlight and sunlight. And so I have this new goal that might take me the rest of my life so that every human on the planet knows that term. But it's a goal for me worth pursuing. You've got to go and figure out what's that goal, that problem that you are so passionate about that it's worth investing your life towards trying to solve. I also think that your creativity is the key to you being successful in any endeavor and so I'm gonna leave by saying: “Use your beautiful, unique space to inspire yourself and those around you, and always let your Earthlight shine.”

Emily

That's beautiful. In terms of bringing Earthlight down to people, could you tell us about, if you can, any projects that you're working on now?

Sian

Sure. I've got a couple of things. I'm working on an Earthlight project with a museum, which I'm super excited about. I've got my book out. I'm doing a lot of like poetry. I've got a t-shirt out that's coming. It's already been announced. It's with Uniqlo. So if you know that brand t-shirt, if you just put that and my name, it's me, Leland Melvin and Gary Lai. Three astronauts came together with Club for the Future and we designed these two t-shirts that are going on sale at the end of September. I'm super excited about that because you'll be able to see the one that represents, has Earthlight in it. They both have Earthlight in it. But it's just super exciting to have those kinds of partnerships. I'm trying to think of what else that I'm working on. I'm always looking for opportunity and I'm an excellent public speaker. So I'm looking for people to hire me and to come and do keynotes. So that's always nice.

Alexa

Super exciting. Personally, I'm a little biased because I love Uniqlo. So I will definitely be on the lookout and maybe buy a bunch for all of my friends and family, too.

Sian

That sounds like a good plan to me. 

Alexa

Awesome.

Sian

You’re gonna have to let me know which one is your favorite. There's two. They're very beautiful. Both of them are. And both of them have Earthlight in it. 

Alexa

Oh, yeah, for sure. I will be so excited to see what the designs look like. Awesome. So Dr. Proctor, where can people find you and your work online if they want to learn more?

Sian

Yeah, please go to space2inspire.art. That's space with the number two, and then inspire, all one word, space2inspire.art. And check out my art store. If you happen to be in downtown Mesa, Arizona, I've got a gallery at 101 Main Street, and so you can go in and buy physical pieces of art there. And yeah, space2inspire.art is where you can. And then follow me @drsianproctor on Instagram. I could always use a little more love there.

Alexa

Perfect. Yeah, and we'll be including all of us in our show notes as well.

Emily

Yes. Thank you so much for speaking with us this evening. It has been such a delight to chat with you.

Alexa

It's truly a dream.

Sian

Thank you for having me.

[interlude music: “Space” by Music_Unlimited]

Emily

Thank you for joining us for today’s episode with Dr. Sian Proctor. Since recording our interview, listeners who follow the space industry will already know that Dr. Proctor’s mission commander on Inspiration 4, Jared Isaacman, is currently the top consideration for NASA Administrator which is incredibly exciting. Also, Dr. Proctor’s art continues its incredible reach and will be going to the Moon aboard Astrolab’s FLIP rover. We will include a link to it in shownotes and on our socials! 

Alexa

You can find us on social at @artastrapodcast on Instagram, X, Facebook, and Bluesky. As a reminder, if you enjoyed the show please consider leaving a rating and/or review on your podcast platform of choice, and tell your friends! This helps other listeners find our podcast. 

Emily

Catch you next time! 

Alexa

See you next time! 

[outro music: “Space” by Music_Unlimited]

Emily Olsen
Next

Episode 11: Mars Photography and Finding Your Way in Space with Dr. Tanya Harrison